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1993 M117 engine - 500GE Problem
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Posted 12/19/2020 5:15 PM
AGuess
Elite Veteran


Date registered: Apr 2006
Location: Holly Springs NC
Vehicle(s): 93 500GE, 93 500GE, 2002 G500
Posts: 717
500
1993 M117 engine - 500GE Problem

Hi Everyone,
on my Son's 500GE, 310K miles, the engine started having problems.

He was driving and started loosing power, no acceleration, then it would stall.

Things I need to do, so I have just done:

1). Replaced the exhaust Cat and Muffler, cat was clogged

2). Replaced the fuel pump and filter, last done in 2012.

3). I have replaced all plugs, wires, dist cap and rotor button and coil.

4). I pulled the fuel pump relay, opened it up, no burnt spots or bad solder joints, I think it is ok.

5). Opened all fuel lines at distributor outflow, tapped on lines, seem ok, fuel comes out.

Engine starts, runs rough, will cut off. Will restart. After it warms up, it runs ok. Idle is ok. Compression is ok.

We shut off engine, let it cool, 15 min, started again, same problem.

What do you suggest I do next, as I am now past the point of my maintenance items and do not know where to look.

Thank you.

AGuess


#242286
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Author
Posted 12/19/2020 9:55 PM
J.R.
Elite Veteran




Date registered: Apr 2006
Location: Southern Maryland
Vehicle(s): 00 G500, 09 911 4S, 11 Cayenne S, 86 280GE (sold)
Posts: 828
500
Re: 1993 M117 engine - 500GE Problem

Any chance bad fuel or diesel found its way into the tank?

Just some random thoughts:

Does it exhibit the same problem if you jumper the fuel pump relay out of the circuit?

It might not be building enough fuel pressure because of a bad fuel pressure regulator. They do go bad.

I think the motor has CIS so you might check the round air plate in the fuel distributor for freedom of movement.

There are also two large resistor somewhere under the hood and on my former 450SEL, they went bad causing a few problems.

#242287 - in reply to #242286
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Author
Posted 1/1/2021 7:00 AM
Inkblotz
Expert




Date registered: Apr 2006
Location: Georgia
Vehicle(s): 90 300GD "Thundering Turtle II", w/ 603A turbo
Posts: 3184
2000
RE: 1993 M117 engine - 500GE Problem

You mentioned the fuel pump but how about the fuel filter. Has that been replaced?
How about your fuel tank. When you open it is it pressurized? The #35 valve could be blocked and the proper amount of fuel is not reaching the engine.



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#242342 - in reply to #242286
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Posted 1/3/2021 3:33 PM
hardtop
New user


Date registered: Apr 2020
Location: Utah, USA
Vehicle(s):
Posts: 4

Re: 1993 M117 engine - 500GE Problem

Check the mass airflow sensor (or replace it). Also verify spark and coil pack(s) if you haven't done that already.
#242349 - in reply to #242286
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Author
Posted 1/16/2021 5:30 PM
AGuess
Elite Veteran


Date registered: Apr 2006
Location: Holly Springs NC
Vehicle(s): 93 500GE, 93 500GE, 2002 G500
Posts: 717
500
Re: 1993 M117 engine - 500GE Problem

When I unplug the wire connector on the EHA unit on the side of the fuel distributor, the problem goes away, the G runs well. The other thing I noticed is that my IR door opener now works again. So now, I wonder if the KE control unit is having problems.
Does anyone know if the KE control unit controls things other than the engine? If it’s bad I need to find a rebuild shop as they are very expensive.
Thank you
Alex
#242387 - in reply to #242287
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Posted 1/18/2021 3:17 PM
AlanMcR
Expert




Date registered: Apr 2006
Location: US, CA, Los Altos
Vehicle(s): G300DT E300DT 230SL
Posts: 3500
2000
Re: 1993 M117 engine - 500GE Problem

I doubt the KE ECU is responsible for anything other than engine management.  On the other hand, you could have bad grounding somewhere and the act of un/plugging is temporarily fixing bad connections.
#242392 - in reply to #242387
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Posted 2/2/2021 7:39 PM
AGuess
Elite Veteran


Date registered: Apr 2006
Location: Holly Springs NC
Vehicle(s): 93 500GE, 93 500GE, 2002 G500
Posts: 717
500
Re: 1993 M117 engine - 500GE Problem

Hi everyone, the problem was the KE control unit.
I found two on eBay, both in the UK.
One was a VDO unit, specifically for a 500GE. MB classic confirmed. I installed it last night and the 500GE runs great again.

The second unit is a Bosch and matches the original part number that I removed. It is off a 500SL, which has the same engine. I am waiting on that one to arrive. I’ll keep it as a spare for my second 500GE.

I appreciate all of your input and help. Trying to keep these 28 year old G’s running is quite the challenge at times.

Alex
#242435 - in reply to #242286
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Posted 4/8/2021 10:21 PM
AGuess
Elite Veteran


Date registered: Apr 2006
Location: Holly Springs NC
Vehicle(s): 93 500GE, 93 500GE, 2002 G500
Posts: 717
500
Re: 1993 M117 engine - 500GE Problem

Update. I thought the KE control unit was bad, but I could not test it.
I took the G to a local Mercedes shop that works on older cars with the M117 engine. It turns out that the 02 sensor was bad. They replaced it, adjusted the fuel mixture and reinstalled the original KE control unit. The engine runs great again. Thanks for all your help
#242628 - in reply to #242286
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Posted 1/14/2022 10:10 AM
KM1
New user


Date registered: Jan 2022
Location:
Vehicle(s):
Posts: 1

Re: 1993 M117 engine - 500GE Problem

I'm having issues with my 500GE and have narrowed it down to the KE-Control unit. Can you tell me the part #'s of what you have found, mine has the part numbers 0 280 800 276 BOSCH and 006 545 95 32 (07). I have been unable to find anything used with the exqct part number but maybe there is an updated crossover.

Thanks



#243341 - in reply to #242286
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Posted 1/14/2022 10:32 AM
Inkblotz
Expert




Date registered: Apr 2006
Location: Georgia
Vehicle(s): 90 300GD "Thundering Turtle II", w/ 603A turbo
Posts: 3184
2000
Re: 1993 M117 engine - 500GE Problem

A quick google search yielded:

https://www.bosch-repair-service.com/en/engine-control-unit/bosch/ke...

https://www.autoecmstore.com/search?type=product&q=0280800276

So it looks like it was used in several different Benz Motors: MERCEDES-BENZ 300 GE [463] 125kW 08/1990 - 08/1993, MERCEDES-BENZ 500 GE AMG [463] 195kW 03/1993 - 09/2001, MERCEDES-BENZ 500 SE, SEL [126] 164kW 09/1985 - 06/1991, MERCEDES-BENZ 500 SE, SEL [126] 170kW 12/1979 - 08/1985, MERCEDES-BENZ 500 SEC [126] 164kW 09/1985 - 06/1991
MERCEDES-BENZ 500 SL Roadster [107] 164kW 01/1986 - 08/1989, MERCEDES-BENZ G 300 [463] 125kW 09/1993 - 10/1994

Time to head to the Pic-in-Pull to grab a used one to make sure you are on the right track.

Edited by Inkblotz 1/14/2022 10:39 AM
#243342 - in reply to #242286
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