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rstl99
Date registered: Dec 1899
Location:
Vehicle(s):
| No thermostat in hot climate: problematic??
Hi again, folks.
I'm considering a local diesel 460 for sale that I've asked a few questions about. Here's another one that I forgot to ask:
WHen the owner got the truck to N-A last Fall (from Middle East, where he bought it), he got some anti-freeze put into the rad (only had water before?), and the mechanic also put in a thermostat, saying that apparently there was not one present before! (straight through). Maybe this is a common practice in hot climates, I don't know, but: would there be negative consequences of running a 617 with no thermostat in hot climate? My first thought is that it can't be good, but I'm not sure... 
Thanks! |
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Titus Pullo
Elite Veteran
Date registered: May 2007
Location: Ottawa, ON, Canada
Vehicle(s): '90 Wolf 240GD, '06 G270 CDI.
Posts: 1010
| RE: No thermostat in hot climate: problematic??
Driving without thermostat definatelly is wrong - the engine runs cold, not reaching the normal operating temperature and I dont beleive it is a normal practice even in warmer countries. Can not say is this damaged the engine or not. |
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AlanMcR
Expert
Date registered: Apr 2006
Location: US, CA, Los Altos
Vehicle(s): G300DT E300DT 230SL
Posts: 3500
| RE: No thermostat in hot climate: problematic??
Titus Pullo - 5/7/2007 5:30 PM
Driving without thermostat definatelly is wrong - the engine runs cold, not reaching the normal operating temperature and I dont beleive it is a normal practice even in warmer countries. Can not say is this damaged the engine or not.
Do not run w/o the thermostat! On many MB's, especially on earlier ones, the thermostat has an active job in recirculating the water in the head. If you remove it, the head and block will no longer heat up evenly. If I recall correctly, the back of the engine (away from water pump) gets very hot and the front is overcooled. Very bad. For a field repair you would be better off forcing the thermostat open and then strapping something in there to keep it open. The engine would run cold, but at least with an even temperature. |
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DUTCH
Administrator Doppelgänger
Date registered: Apr 2006
Location: US, GA, Atlanta
Vehicle(s): 2015 Audi Q7 3.0 TDI,2018 Sprinter
Posts: 9963
| RE: No thermostat in hot climate: problematic??
AlanMcR - 5/7/2007 9:15 PM
Do not run w/o the thermostat! On many MB's, especially on earlier ones, the thermostat has an active job in recirculating the water in the head.
It does on the newer M112 & M113 (G500) engines, too. The engine is set up to circulate properly with the thermostat closed so that it warms up quicker; and the emissions go down with the warmup. The fuel mileage also improves as the engine warms up. |
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Titus Pullo
Elite Veteran
Date registered: May 2007
Location: Ottawa, ON, Canada
Vehicle(s): '90 Wolf 240GD, '06 G270 CDI.
Posts: 1010
| RE: No thermostat in hot climate: problematic??
AlanMcR - 5/7/2007 9:15 PM
Do not run w/o the thermostat! On many MB's, especially on earlier ones, the thermostat has an active job in recirculating the water in the head. If you remove it, the head and block will no longer heat up evenly. If I recall correctly, the back of the engine (away from water pump) gets very hot and the front is overcooled. Very bad. For a field repair you would be better off forcing the thermostat open and then strapping something in there to keep it open. The engine would run cold, but at least with an even temperature. No, it is not me  . I never run w/o thermostat. Actually I did it once back in 90s, with my Dayhatsu Feroza back in Europe, but my head gasket was shot and I was hours far from any civilization. |
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4-live
Date registered: Dec 1899
Location:
Vehicle(s):
| RE: No thermostat in hot climate: problematic??
some older diesels wil get a overheated verry quick, and if they are sold, they take the termostate out or drill holles in it to mask this problem.
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rstl99
Date registered: Dec 1899
Location:
Vehicle(s):
| RE: No thermostat in hot climate: problematic??
4-live - 5/8/2007 2:56 AM
some older diesels wil get a overheated verry quick, and if they are sold, they take the termostate out or drill holles in it to mask this problem.
There is no limit to the ingenuity of Man! (or used car sellers!! :-) |
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hipine
Date registered: Jul 2006
Location: US, CO, Bailey
Vehicle(s): 460 1980 280GE w. 617A
| RE: No thermostat in hot climate: problematic??
The thermostat in the 617 doesn't do any of those fancy water diverting activities that others are talking about. It's just a simple on/off valve in the upper radiator hose. The worst thing that will happen is that the motor might run cool. Not optimal, but also not dangerous to the eninge in and of itself. The other poster who mentioned that the missing thermostat may be masking some other problem has a very good point though. Egypt or not, the 617 should chug happily along all day long just as it left the factory, thermostat and all. If it was removed to avoid overheating, there's very likely another problem that needs to be addressed in the cooling system. -Dave G. |
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dai
Expert
Date registered: Apr 2006
Location: Oregon USA
Vehicle(s): 300GD 300TD BMW R100RS Landini 80F
Posts: 2110
| Re: No thermostat in hot climate: problematic??
The 617 is all cast construction, block and head and can withstand a lot of abuse. It should be run with a thermostat but it is unlikely that damage to the motor has occured. If the motor is stone cold and is started when the glow light goes out it should start up and settle into an idle without much smoke. If it is running rough or difficult to start then the motor is probably worn or has glowplug or injector issues. A typical thing that a seller will do is to connect a block heater and warm up the motor before the prospective buyer starts it. A very worn diesel will start up and run if warmed up in this way. Ask to start the truck the next morning and check to see if the motor is cold with your hand. The 617 series motor is one of the most reliable engines that MB has ever made. It set the records in the C111 in your photo there. Just make sure you have a healthy one because they can get costly to rebuild. If the price is right for the truck but the motor is sick consider dropping a turbo version in there. The stock 300GD does not have enought power, a big 88 ponies under the heavy hood.
-Dai |
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Titus Pullo
Elite Veteran
Date registered: May 2007
Location: Ottawa, ON, Canada
Vehicle(s): '90 Wolf 240GD, '06 G270 CDI.
Posts: 1010
| RE: No thermostat in hot climate: problematic??
hipine - 5/8/2007 10:16 AM
. If it was removed to avoid overheating, there's very likely another problem that needs to be addressed in the cooling system. -Dave G. |
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Chris
Veteran
Date registered: Sep 2006
Location: Calgary, AB
Vehicle(s): 2012 G550, 2012 GL350 BT
Posts: 241
| Re: No thermostat in hot climate: problematic??
Rob,
I was going to send you a PM about this truck but I see you beat me to it! Have you spoken to the guy as I wondered if with all the work that is needed is the BIG reason why he is dumping it after importing it not to long ago.
I see this truck in question has the dual doors in the back and is an 88 but what I would like to know from those that know if this was only an option for the very early civilian G's. I think the CDN military models have them so I guess I just answered my question. |
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